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This book is really terrific. The authors have taken 5e's pretty whitebread version of d20 and given us a number of great ways to use it.
Highlights at my table:
- Ranger and adept (monk) players are very excited that their character now seems to better match the source materials. If I can get someone else to run, I'll pop into a marshall.
- Culture half of the old "race" concepts worked so well with backgrounds.
- My players are very interested in the exploration and social interaction part of the storytelling so it isn't just interconnected fights.
There's a lot more to praise here, but most of that is in the other two books.
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I loved this sourcebook. It does some things that I did myself about a soft place between the planes and provides
- a place that players can investigate and have an adventure that involves a portal, making portals possible in universe.
- an adventure involving planar travel and the need to escape. A heist? sort of...
- a magical mystery tour (I'm old, so pardon the analogies) as wacky but gritty as Time Bandits while being as interesting as Excalibur's Crosstime Caper or good runs of the Exiles.
- sensible rules for skill piggybacking for team play
- a visit to Cynosure from Grimjack. I mean to Sigil from Planescape. I mean to The Nex, from Tim Pratt. I mean Amber. You know, the city of doors, the city of portals, the city in the center of reality. But the gritty one, so forget Amber.
- a very-hard to manage class for teleporting and realm porting who may ruin a lot of fun. He may hog spotlight if played badly, but isn't that every class, really? Just a little more so.
- a really neat companion class. Experimenting, I was able to build the equivalent of low-level Gammera to accompany my annoying small child character. I also built a perfectly viable page who was able to summon the Warrior Queen to his rescue.
- Interesting ideas about progressions of pantheons of gods as different invaders brought newer ideas.
With all that plus plus on the table, why on earth is this a four?
verbal diarrhea - I am all in favor of the 424 cool ideas Ash tossed at me in this book. So many hooks, adventure ideas, ways to go. All I needed was a couple of options built for 4 of those ideas, and then 420 just like they are now. One or two solid places to stand. For example, threesides plaza on page 16. Three cool adventure hooks.
- How about giving me four choices for the changeling's motivation? Maybe I will pick one, or maybe it will inspire a better one, but it's easier to parallel or oppose an existing idea.
- Why are the names so similar? Give me three ideas. Maybe we've crossed worlds. Maybe...
- What's with that kiss? Cynical avoidance of responsiblity? Desperation? Crossdimensional mistaken identity? Just toss out some choices.
After a while, so much openended thought wears me out. I've already made enough choices here. My brain is full. Give me a little more to pick from. I need a little scaffolding partway between traditional TWMPRG modules and this 424 ideas with no backing.
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This is a fun and shortish adventure in which an ancient cult has raised their Big Bad of Doom to get revenge on the society that oppressed them. Our heroes get involved and oppress them again, hopefully. It has many interesting questions and ideas that trail off and beg to be used with player backgrounds and connections.
Highlights
I loved the idea of crannogs used in a swamp, especially when the thematically much more Central American Lizards are attacking. There’s no specific callout for the crannogs, and there could be a little more explanation about what they ARE to differentiate them from say, wharves on the land next to the swamp.
The author’s callouts are gold, and I only wish that there were more of them. The size discussion (about the size and impact of large/huge creatures and the author’s intent) is especially strong and just the kind of smart-guy-talks-about-story-effect that works for me. The detailed plan for the main villain if her lair is attacked (with several options to escalate, impact, or scare players) is excellent, and what EVERY Big Bad should have so they don’t just stand around while a Paladin with a sword of Whacking wanders around their lair, then comes upon them sleeping and hits them for another divine smite. I am also glad that the author put time and effort into figuring out why the Icons might care or hook in their party contacts, although see below for minor concerns.
My group is unusually blessed in GMs, so I run one-shots every three sessions. This is shaping up to be a beautiful two-shot that just fits my needs without having so much tramping around chasing cultists or having only a quick climax in a one-shot.
Why 4 stars instead of 5?
- Despite the company’s numerous other 13th age-related merch, his references to the icons are a little generic and involve a certain amount of confusion about title, name, and gender. I assume that he massaged the normative or traditional icons for his own purposes, but he didn’t mention it at all in the text, as far as I can tell. Contrast this with John Marvin from Gods and Icons, who calls out his process in his work on this site like The Overworld and Beyond.
- I think that the author found the escalation die very exciting. Of course, the dragon uses that die against the players. It’s very thematic that a destiny-touched creature like a dragon can use the players’ strongest powers against them, even escalation! I’m less excited about the escalation die being used for the lizard priests, the giant venus flytrap, and even the piranha in the dragon’s lair. Now it’s beginning to feel like it’s just an “everything hits more” die. Instead of being a way to mitigate poor player luck, it’s just a way things can become more unbalanced if the GM has hot dice.
- Similarly, I think that the Mummy's Curse is a bit too powerful. If the players wake one while fighting the 4 by 4 set of mud zombies, they might take 10 points ongoing for four or five turns, then have limited or no ability to heal that damage due to the curse. I think a hard save and no healing IN combat seems much better, since you'll likely have that unhealable character keel over a fight or two later from unrelated damage that can't be healed. Perhaps your table is less variable than mine, but my players tend to use those 8 or so recoveries during or between their four fights for the day. Making character recoveries unusable because it makes the curse more thematic (it does) is maybe not being a fan of the characters as much as the fan of a Kool idea. If you're going to break a rule, like Save-ends, it needs to pay off more.
- Creature referencing should either be first appearance or, better, a separate page or two that is easily marked. Go to the very first fight in the book on page 6, the fight that sets the tone for the ensuing adventure, the fight that should be very sense-based, thrilling, and engaging. The five creatures referenced for this fight all have the basic four-number stat block, but to find the powers, theme, and attacks for each creature, the GM is referenced to:
- The 13th Age core book (fair enough)
- Area A2 (no page listed)
- Area A1 (no page listed)
- Right here is a stat block only for the NPC rangers assisting the party
- Area E4 (no page listed)
Why in the name of the Crusader’s Gods didn’t you just write a final section with your new creatures in it, then key EVERY encounter back to it? If I’m in B2, opposing five to seven other minds controlling powerful characters in order to make my creatures look deadly but make the excitement happen, I do NOT want to have to flip back to B1 and A to find the other stat blocks! That said, I made my own summary sheet with all the stats on it and will run the scenario with that.
It was easy enough to modify for my own purposes, and the core story was strong. I would definitely purchase another scenario from this author. I don’t SEE any more deadly delves for 13th age yet, but...
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Creator Reply: |
Thank you for taking the time to review our adventure. I really appreciate it.
Concerning the icons, we cannot use the icons from the core book. These are not open for anyone to use. However, we are allowed to create "nudge, nudge, wink, wink," "close but still different" icons. So that is what we did. We hope that they are close enough that you can make use of them with little issue.
Again, thank you for taking the time to review. We hope you enjoy the rest of our 13th Age line up. |
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I loved this thing. The idea of the story points made this an ideal sale for me.
I have a group of 13th age characters. One has major thief skills and two others have interesting magic skills. I wanted everyone to have a quick opportunity to shine, so I borrowed heavily from this, tossed in a social challenge for the new Bard, and made Thalia more of moral quandry for remaining players, the two paladins. I had a great "getting to know you" introduction for the new player.
Like the last reviewer (Sarah?), I also had some trouble parsing the story points versus the keyed entries until I had read all the way through. Once I had seen it all, I actually preferred this breakdown as it made the story points stand out more and that's what I was here for.
I bought it at the free level and then came back and paid because it was excellent. Where is the next one?
Why four stars? -> I'd have wanted an extra scene (which I added myself) to fill this out to a longer session (4 hours) with challenges keyed to other kinds of deception. Also, the no-magic thing is a killer if your team is full of magic-using characters. More interesting ways to disable "cheating" magic were how I had to go. I would have loved to have some in module instead of making it up myself. Two heads are better than one.
Henrick - you should be getting a link to a google doc from your publisher.
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Creator Reply: |
Hi John!
Thank you for your comments and I am very happy that you had fun using this! I'm especially happy that it was possible to adapt it to your setting, as adaptability was in the back of my head when I designed the individual rooms.
As for story delivery, did you end up liking the way it was structured or would you suggest changing it? I'm considering just adding a "read from cover to cover before starting" instruction to the DM as I see how one would need a complete overview to really see how it unfolds.
I agree that the no-magic thing is not optimal and I tried to include a few explanations (either a pocket dimension or an anti-magic bubble), but I could have gone into more detail. I just couldn't think of a way to make it workable with free reign on magic use and I really wanted players to focus on the logic and puzzle side of it without "cheating".
I also wanted to add more rooms, but I wanted the challenges to be "different" and I ran out of creative juice after staring at a blank page for weeks. I hope to be able to make a follow-up to see what happens next!
Thanks again for your input! |
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I recently tried out this set along with the free Master Tiles 0 from Skeleton Key and the Butcher's Lair from Empty Room. I was interested in all three because they all use the "lay down elements on your PDF" technology.
I bought the bundle and for $15 or so received Set 1, Set 2, the Caverns Set, and Traps and Hazards. This definitely gave me a good bang for my buck since I was able to get enough pieces to do interesting things. The art is serviceable and prints well. I have printed more tiles from these guys than from either of their competitors because this helped fill my need for other tiles with generic components.
I expect, however, to print very few tiles from these sets in the future. These are the worst and least interesting tiles to use of the three. Their arrangement is more or less random in the folders. Many of the tiles are identical except for the addition of a door, WHICH COULD HAVE BEEN A DROP DOWN ELEMENT IN THE PDF! None of the PDFs are multipage, which means you have twenty odd separate PDFs to work on separately. Even the thumbnail files provided are not spaced wall and are on separate PDFs themselves. Unless you want to print the four or five thumbnail PDFs for each product and then store them in folders to imagine or print multiple times to be able try out the arrangements, you'll have no easy way to follow up an inspiration for a scenario.
The art add-ons for each PDF page show a real quantity over quality approach. Each PDF has layers to add a chest or two, crates, barrels, a number of chairs (this is cool, since you can turn on 1 and 3 only for your placement), two tables, a skeleton, and a rubble pile. The problem is that these items may or may not be oddly placed and they are EXACTLY THE SAME across all products. Every single skeleton is the same, every table (of the two), every mold growth, every green slime pool, every watery area, every gold spill. There is such a thing as too much motif. It leaves the tiles much less interesting than the competition.
There are three three tricks that I think Skeleton Key did better. Each page of the PDF itself has the logo and copyright information. Skeleton Key gives you the ability to turn that off before printing to save ink. This avoids the hassle of copying to a graphics program and trying to get the size just right. Skeleton Key also experimented with other walls. They have walls that actually change the shape of the room, letting me have an L-shaped room with all the goodies and a 6x6 room with the same range of choices. Similarly, both of the others gave a multipage PDF containing a linked set of tiles so the user could easily plan connections and decide on an overall theme without having to open 20 different PDFs.
Empty Room did a better job making their tiles connect as well. They also were better at making interesting art that inspires the user to put together a scenario while using the program. It didn't hurt that Empty Room included a couple of pages of dungeon dressing appropriate to the scenario to further add flexibility.
POSITIVES: Easy, generic, uses reliable images
NEGATIVES: bad organization, poor ease of planning, too much repetition.
I would buy the competition or just use the free Master Tiles before buying this product.
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I recently tried out this product along with MasterTiles from Skeleton Key and EZtiles from Fat Dragon. I was interested in all three because of the PDF technology that they're using to add and subtract elements before printing.
This product definitely had the most interesting art, with shading and color quality superior to the other two. I wanted to buy all three products, but was on a budget until I made up my mind what worked better. These guys also included a couple of pages of compatible elements to lay down across the tiles separately. (I think I have a way to stage that weird demon blood trial from Thunderspire Labyrinth now.) I give them top marks for what I received.
In each of these PDF products, the elements on the page that the user can add and remove with layers is a bit weird. All publishers have their own ideas about what's important and where it goes. Empty Room definitely wins the "matches John's ideas about needs" award. Want to turn the gory cut up body kitchen into a standard kitchen for RPG use in an upstanding lord's keep? Just turn off the butcher's table and take the body out of the fireplace. All the extra gore and blood spatters on the floor go with them and you can use this room in another context. Similarly, have you ever struggled with knowing where the walls were with D&D's tiles because interior walls aren't shown? Empty Rooms lets you put a wall across each possible entrance individually, so that you can choose the access points and everyone knows how to get from one spot to another.
The guys at Empty Room have missed only two tricks that I think Skeleton Key did better. Each page of the PDF itself has the logo and copyright information. Skeleton Key gives you the ability to turn that off before printing to save ink. This avoids the hassle of copying to a graphics program and trying to get the size just right. Skeleton Key also experimented with other walls. They have walls that actually change the shape of the room, letting me have an L-shaped room with all the goodies and a 6x6 room with the same range of choices.
My only COMPLAINT about these is the price point to get in. I downloaded the freebie from SK and one from Empty Room. I went to DL one from Fat Dragon, and they had a bundle that was hard to pass up. I would have tried the Empty Room bundle at $20 or even $22 for the Dungeon Rooms 1 and 2 and one more (this product or the pit one) and just skipped Fat Dragon's altogether if such a bundle had existed.
POSITIVES: best art, best accessories in kit, most sensible decisions about item placement and removal.
NEGATIVES: Not quite as clever at using PDF technology for extra flexibility, a couple of dollars more expensive.
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Creator Reply: |
Thanks for the in depth review John! It's always great to hear what customers liked and disliked about our products. This way we can make changes on future releases that hopefully improve our items. Just so you know, all tile sets now have the ability to turn off the extra text before printing! |
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I recently tried out this Master Tile and two competing products, Empty Room's tiles and Fat Dragon's EZTiles. All three make use of the technology to drop down elements onto your PDF tiles.
This set is "only" five tiles, less than the competition. I found it just as useful, however, since these guys have thought of one more wrinkle than the others. One of the things I can do with this set is remove the walls AND THE FLOOR TILES FOLLOW SUIT. Let me explain further. The base tile of all five of these tiles is a 6x6 tile full of floor. When I turn the walls on and off, the wall comes in at, say, the upper left corner, cutting off the four top left squares. Unlike the competition, who give me set shapes, I can use the set shape created by adding the walls, or just make a 6x6 tile with the same additions (platforms, arcane runes, bars/porctilli, etc.) in any combination.
I could be wrong, but I feel like I get more "cool items" to turn on and off on the master tiles than I do with the other two. Playing with tile 2, for example, I can make a before and after trap with a dunk into an acid pool, a recessed floor area with a void orb and piping (the macguffin for the heroes to destroy?), an L-shaped chamber with or without bars, or many other combination.
I do feel that SkeletonKey's art is a bit more cartoony(?) or early D&D-ey, primitive and a little abtracted. Take a look at all their cool E-adventure tiles. If those are great art for your purposes, then ignore my qualms. If it looks a little cheesy or abstracted, then you might think about experimenting a great deal with this product before you lash out for any of the sequels.
POSITIVE: Most flexible, combines well with other SK products
NEGATIVE: slight cartoony quality to the art.
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