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Titanomachy (A Collection of Threats for Scion Second Edition) $14.99
Average Rating:4.2 / 5
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Titanomachy (A Collection of Threats for Scion Second Edition)
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Titanomachy (A Collection of Threats for Scion Second Edition)
Publisher: Onyx Path Publishing
by Terry R. [Verified Purchaser]
Date Added: 06/16/2021 23:47:17

TLDR:

Strengths Some wonderfully written individual titans and some amazing "so this is the MO for this group" section. The Theoi writing was just flat out well written. Amazing antagonist lists where the authors seem to have fun putting ancient beasts and legends into a modern world. That's pretty cool. Everyone gets an enemy. For any given agenda, the storyteller has like five options. You want someone to destroy everything? May I interest you in like 12 options each doing it in an interesting way or not? Really solid advice on balancing encounters. Normally books either overmath or get real vague on this shit, not this book. New Knacks/Boons/Relics/Guides awesome The stuff referencing dragon is super optional. I almost wanted more interconnects. If you're "but dragon isn't necessary!" person, it's like maybe 200 words in the entire book and using the power of "just make something up" you should be fine.

Weaknesses I really feel like the book didn't have a unitary vision of what the Titans were. Even a "there are four types of Titans; pantheon rejects, enemies of the gods, those called to primordial, and those who eshew worship" or something could have really helped the book stay together. Like, Aten really wants mortal worship and gets it, but the defining feature are the Callings. Some of those really felt like a god could have one. There was little interconnectedness. It felt like the sections were written in silos and only later lightly connected. A real rogue's gallery is marked by teamwork. I kind of wanted some lair sections. Like you got some cool-ass monsters but like, where do they sleep? The STing antagonists felt real weak.

Minor quibbles: I read the dead tree copy and boy some page numbers would have been great. Finding things in Hero or the rest of the book took a bit of work to do. Alternatively, add way more links in the PDF. There are a few typographic errors and such. Every book has them but if a book has none then the clouds part and the text is pulled heaven-ward. Man, Scion has a lot of capitalized game terms. A few reminders up front would have really gone a long way.



Rating:
[4 of 5 Stars!]
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Titanomachy (A Collection of Threats for Scion Second Edition)
Publisher: Onyx Path Publishing
by John S. [Verified Purchaser]
Date Added: 03/14/2021 14:11:50

Finally, a book that presents an option to play a Scion who doesn't concern themselves with how their actions affect those around them! That isn't to say that your character is objectively evil, but other characters may start to find that your sociopathic narcissism and singleminded pursuit of achieving your goals makes you difficult to tolerate for long periods of time.

The Titans are, to put it bluntly, not content with the current state of the World, and wish to impose some manner of change to the way things are. As one of their Scions, you presumably share their sentiments, although you may not necessarily share the same vision of what changes need to be implemented. While the Gods and their champions fight to preserve the status quo and maintain the world as it currently is, the Titans and their ilk are fighting to alter it on a fundamental level.

Other Titans, however, choose to take on a more apathetic stance on the war between them and the Gods. The suffering of mortals and the World at large doesn't concern them, but they lack the sadism necessary to actively contribute to the misery. Titans such as these may be able to form some sort of truce with the Gods, however tenuous it might be.

Unfortunately, I feel like the book didn't go quite as in depth as it could have been. Titanomachy introduces 5 new Callings for your character (Destroyer, Adversarry, Primordial, Tyrant and Monster), but doesn't introduce any new supernatural origins for your character options. It's a book about playing as the Scion of an ancient power that predates the Gods. You'd think they would have been able to throw in some new supernatural creatures to play as?

At the very least, they could have added a Giant origin, given how closely integrated they are with Norse mythology, and the prophecy of Ragnarok.

The book also isn't scaled to power for the (as of yet) upcoming release of 2nd edition Demigod; which brings up the question of whether or not there will be more Titanomachy books in the future to support the escalation of power, or if they're going to leave that up to the Story Tellers and Players to hash out on their own?

The Titans introduced in this book are pretty cool, such as Echidna (always happy to see a mother of monsters figure), and even Cronus has decided to make an appearance. So if you want to make a Scion who is siblings with Hades, Poseidon and Zeus, then go nuts with it! We also have a newly resurrected Ymir and Balor joining the fight against the Gods and their ilk.

All in all, I would recommend this book for anybody who's interested in playing a character who is primarily focused on achieving their own personal goals, without concern for how it affects those around them.

But the fact that it mostly just updates the already existing content, rather than expand upon it is what lowers its overall score for me. I give it an average 3 out of 5. It's not super great, but I still consider it a good addition to the library.



Rating:
[3 of 5 Stars!]
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Titanomachy (A Collection of Threats for Scion Second Edition)
Publisher: Onyx Path Publishing
by David A. [Verified Purchaser]
Date Added: 11/17/2020 14:03:19

TL;DR: There were some good bits of lore and mechanics, but this book reverts to bad, '1st-edition-ish' philosophy far too much.

So, let me start off with saying the things I did like, and why I'm giving this two stars rather than one.

There are good sections. The Orisha's section is awesome, predominantly because it essentially mocks the premise of the rest of the book. The Deva have some really cool and well-done members in there, and while the Theoi are questionable here, Echidna is great.

The mechanics are good, too. The new callings are nice, there's some good antagonists and other new Storyguide mechanics that I enjoy. If mechanics is predominantly what you want, this is definitely a solid recommend - although if you're a player and not a Storyguide, seeing as the new callings are the only parts that pertain to you, you might want to wait for Demigod as I hear they'll be republished in that.

The Internet Trolls are incredible.

There's a few parts of the book I won't comment on, such as the Kami and the Manitou, simply because I haven't got enough knowledge about those cultures.

But now, the stuff that was bad, and that I think I can comment on.

The Tuatha Dé Domnann are just... inaccurate and insensitive. The implication that Balor caused the Potato Famine is just... that wasn't anything to do with supernatural. That was the British being horrific.

Belenus and Cernunnos don't belong here, they're the gods of long-dead continental European religion and are part of the Nemetondevos according to another book in 2e. Admittedly these other 'versions' are acknowledged, but it just... doesn't sit right. It feeds the 'Celts were all one culture' concept that many have. And that concept is wrong. Not only that, claiming Cernunnos is the Horned God of Wicca (as in, this Cernunnos, not the idea that an old remnant of the power that was Cernunnos has somewhat been revived by Wicca as that god - that's a cool concept, this isn't) is really dodgy when, while he may be the most 'good' amongst these guys, is still associated with the 'evil side' of a pantheon. These are bold claims about what you claim to be the god of a living religion.

I can't really comment much on the other Titans of the Tuatha. But, as far as I know, one of them we know next to nothing about, and the other's writeup seems to imply Ireland's in the UK. So yeah.

Final thing on the Tuatha is something I didn't notice the first few times I glanced through, but is honestly one of the most grievous things done to them. Indech, who was the King of the Fomorians, who would have been an incredible choice for a Titan instead of, you know, the Gaulish Gods, has been turned into Frankenstein for the sake of having an excuse to put the Monster in. If you want the Monster, as a more modern story to add to the game, invent someone to create it. Hell, have them be a sample Scion of Prometheus (and writeup Prometheus) and really go full-on with the 'modern Prometheus' vibe. I'd love that. Don't appropriate someone with nothing to do with any of that.

The Aesir are weird. Nidhoggr is written as if he has a rivalry with the Dragon Níðhöggr, who I assume is coming in Scion: Dragon. A few reasons why this is confusing: first, IIRC, Dragon is intended to be optional. A potential addition to your games if you want it, portayed like the Nemetondevos, Teros, and the upcoming Masks of the Mythos. I honestly quite like the idea of Dragon, but having lines of this book, which is supposedly part of the World's mainstream 'canon', refer to it is odd. The second reason is that if you want a rival for Nidhoggr, he has one. Right there in the myths. The unnamed eagle, who sits at the top of Yggdrasil. They send insults to each other via Ratatoskr, the squirrel. But the eagle is only briefly mentioned, and the squirrel is completely absent. Also, the whole thing about spelling being an argument, albeit a somewhat sarcastic one, about Níðhöggr being older, is a bit odd.

Ymir's dead, so not a threat. Reviving him... like, it's somewhat understandable, but not including, say, any of Loki's children (I'm aware Jormungandr and Fenris are more animals than logical thinkers, but Hel could surely fit in) and deciding to revive someone long dead... it's an odd decision. And, come to think of it, the Monster purview works fine for more 'bestial' Titans so yeah. What the Hel. Throw in at least one of the children of Loki instead. (And yes, I know they're mentioned, but none of them get a proper writeup.)

The Netjer have problems, but not really any more so than their godly counterparts' writeup in Hero. Aten is better than he was in 1e. That's not saying much, admittedly, but overall, I find his writeup okay. Apep/Apophis is another victim of the Dragon references, but it's dealt with a bit better. Isfet should probably be a Primordial, not a Titan, but I can deal with this. In fact, the writeup says she has the 'Primordial' calling; I'm assuming that typo was caused due to the writer having similar ideas to me, and meaning to write 'Primeval'. I should submit that to the errata. Finally, in the art, Apep is depicted with a cobra-like head fan, and as far as I know, he's not really depicted like that in Egyptian art. Just a plain old giant snake, no flourishes.

That's about all I can talk about with my knowledge. Oh, and looking back, the description of merfolk... like, the vicious concept presented here is fine, but there are also mermaid tales that do cast them as beautiful women, or even men, luring people to their doom - or perhaps not, perhaps falling in love with them and taking them back into their home under the waves. The idea presented here kinda contradicts the 'All Myths Are True' premise.

So, a final thing. Years ago, a young me stumbled across Scion First Edition, and was fascinated. Here was a game that was inspired by the tales I loved, and would allow me to play in worlds like those written about by Rick Riordan as a child of the gods. I plunged in, and expected the people making the book had done their research, and I took in a lot of misconceptions about the gods presented.

Now, 2e is here. Someone in a similar position to me back then will probably go for it over 1e - it's more up-to-date, more revised. New editions are meant to be better, and 2e is better. It's balanced, and it's pretty well-researched, and on its failings in research, it still tends to be respectful. And so someone in that position won't find the awful ideas that were present then, and instead find what Scion 2e has done, and take that as the truth about these religions. And that is good.

But then that someone may find this book. And, seeing as the research and respect so far has been good, they think to themselves, why shouldn't this be the same? And they'll take it, and they'll be plunged into misconceptions in the same way I was, and they might not be as lucky as me and find out that what they read was wrong. And that makes me beyond sad.



Rating:
[2 of 5 Stars!]
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Titanomachy (A Collection of Threats for Scion Second Edition)
Publisher: Onyx Path Publishing
by Moros F. H. [Verified Purchaser]
Date Added: 10/29/2020 17:59:31

The Knacks, Relics, Guides, and antagonists are good and are welcome additions to Scion. However the lore and Creatures are overall bad. The Creatures are not built in any way like how the rules for building one is described in Hero, the lore in general with the exceptions of the Kami, Orisha, and Deva are often poorly written, nonsensical and often arbitarly ignore mythology for conflict that is often more boring or lesser then the conflict already present in the source mytholog. The biggest example being Nidhogg who for some unfathomable reason has himself but spelled properly(Nidhoggr) as his rival when he already had a clear cut rival in the mythology: the eagle at the top Yggdrasil, a rivalry forged on constant insults they send to each other. Which is replaced by a riverly with his properly spelled self over who's the real Nidhoggr? Worst of all Nidhogg's write up contradicts the devaloper's assurance that Scion Dragon would not be treated as canon by the rest of the gameline, except Nidhoggr is a full Dragon in the Scion Dragon sense. In general the lore feels like the worst parts of 1e's lore, nonsensical changes that add nothing at best and at worst are activly worse then the conflict already present in the source material which is the worst kind of change



Rating:
[2 of 5 Stars!]
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Titanomachy (A Collection of Threats for Scion Second Edition)
Publisher: Onyx Path Publishing
by Mathias K. [Verified Purchaser]
Date Added: 10/19/2020 06:49:30

This is one of those books that makes it difficult to use a five-star rating as a medium, but I will endeavor to try and clarify what I think of this book and why, in spite of genuinely enjoying the majority of the book, I ultimately gave it a somewhat low grade.

Firstly, let me preface this by saying that the mechanics of the book are absolutely top-shelf stuff, both for giving player Scions access to new tools and for running more antagonistic Scions. The antagonists section, while it does have its misses (and we'll talk more about thise later) is a very good collection of antagonists for a Hero-tier group to face off with, and some of them are interesting, novel takes on old myth that are still very firmly grounded in an understanding of these mythologies. If what you're looking for is a good collection of systems to help you run your games, this is not a bad pickup.

However, the first section on Titans is, in my opinion, hewing closer to Scion First Edition in all the wrong ways. While many of the writeups (in particular the Órisha, Deva and Shen) take great care to present Titanic threats that problematize the Gods and are simultaneously grounded in tangible legend, many of the other writeups seem to be made up from wholecloth with uninspired and, in some cases, frankly offensive ideas.

Some of them are benign, if frustrating: Why does nobody know Thor's mother is Jord when we, in the real world the World is based on, have several texts where she is named as his mother? Why is Kronos, ruler of the Golden Age of Man and a god associated with fruitful harvests, a tyrant who represents entropy and cold? Why is Indech, a prodigious warrior-king who killed the king of the Túatha Dé Danann, a Doctor Frankenstein-esque mad scientist? Why is Bres' dethroning via satire, a cosmology-defining moment, completely omitted?

Others are not so benign. Why are fully half of the Túatha Dé Domnann not based on Irish figures? Why does one of them have a specialization in 'Primitive' art? Why is there an implication that Balor caused the Great Famine in Ireland? Why are the Fomoir fish-people who salvage things out of the oceans like the Fomorians out of the Dresden Files? Why is Ymir, the primordial being whose very body and being was used to create the Nine Worlds, hanging around so the art could have a nice 'earth, fire and frost' motif when there's no shortage of not-dead hrimthurssar who could have filled the position without having one of the deadest beings in Norse mythology be still-present? Why is the only reference to the Bretons a twisted version of the Ankou, further stepping on a culture that's already facing attempts by the French government to stamp it out?

They smack of a development team that thought their source material wasn't 'interesting' enough and decided the only way to remedy this was to fill in the blanks, and doing so in a way that is disrespectful and stereotypical rather than respectful and thoughtful, as most of the rest of the game line has generally succeeded at being. And while I'd like to give a higher rating to a mechanically strong book, I feel that the additions made to the setting in the book have done more harm than good to the World as a setting.



Rating:
[2 of 5 Stars!]
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Titanomachy (A Collection of Threats for Scion Second Edition)
Publisher: Onyx Path Publishing
by Tony A. [Verified Purchaser]
Date Added: 09/10/2020 18:35:32

Disclaimer: At the time of this writing, this book is released an Advance PDF. Some details may change between now and the final version.

Introduction: Short and sweet, but it sets the tone for the whole book. Scion is a game that has to balance "real world" vs. "game world." This is a book that is very much "game world." But it's up front about it from the beginning. The Titanomachy itself, the premise the book is based on, is a "game world" idea and has no basis in the "real world." So there are going to be liberties taken and stories written to manufacture a Titanomachy. Some things are going to be attached to pantheons that don't make sense but they're there for organization purposes only (and besides, the Titans are enemies of the pantheons anyway, they don't actually "belong"). There's going to be "game world" decisions going on here and the introduction doesn't shy away from that. Rating: 3 out of 5 (Gets the job done but there's nothing really more to say on it than what it is.)

Chapter One - The Titans: I personally feel that this chapter is a little hit or miss with me. Which is disappointing because this was the big selling point of the book. The Titans! Writ bold and big. Let me clarify though. This is disappointing, not because any of it being inherently bad when taken within the context of the book's earlier conceit, but because this is the chapter that is most "game world." Which means, depending on your table, this could actually be the chapter that gets the least use from you. I think the idea of Ymir being reborn through his granddaughter is a fascinating idea and a great storytelling device, but there's a very real possiblity that it won't fit into the tone and mythic setting of your table. I like the idea of Cernunnos being an errant Scion who got his hands on the power of a fallen god and became a Titan, but can see how that may not fit everyone's vision of the game. I like a lot of the ideas that are presented here in this chapter, but recognize that they are the most divisive part of the book.

One major note in this chapter's favor, however, is the opening which features the introdution of Titanic Callings. While these are used primarily to define Titans, these can be applied to non-Titans as well to flesh out the existing gods or provide options for a player's Scions. These are fun and engaging and even if you don't like the sample Titans that are presented, these provide some additional tools to add onto the "create your own god" systems out of the Companion to make your own Titans. Rating: 3 out of 5 (The pick-and-choose nature of this chapter leaves something to be desired and makes this the overall weakest chapter. But the ideas are solid and enjoyable when looked at on their own.)

Chapter Two - Storyguiding: Regardless of your feelings on the chapter on Titans, this is the real meat of the book and the most important chapter. This explores several methods and options for including conflict with the Titans and their spawn into your games. It addresses matters of scale, presentation, conflict and collusion and the best way to handle procedural, intrigue and combat situations when dealing with the titans and their spawn. It touches on the relationships between Titans and Dragons (touching on the upcoming Scion: Dragon which some of the Titans in the last chapter are certainly mingled with) and delves into different ways to interact with Titan Scions and other titanspawn.

It closes out with several mini-adventures that serve as examples of how to put these concepts into play and serve as jumping off points for further adventures. Neither of these adventures are very beefy, but as idea starters and examples of concepts in practice, they're quite sufficient. Rating: 5 out of 5 (Easily the most useful chapter in the book and well worth the price even if you use nothing else in here... though you will because...)

Chapter Three - Antagonists: If Chapter Two is the meat of this book, then Chapter Three is all the juicy bits. It includes a system to add in some Titan-specific threats as Archetypes and includes new Qualities and Flairs to tailor your titanspawn. And then the rest of the chapter is a very crunchy collection of pre-generated antagonists of all sorts, including several sample Scions of the Titans of various sorts, including of Titans that weren't presented in the book to jumpstart a Storyguide's creativity. This chapter, if nothing else, is the bestiary that the Scion game has badly needed in my opinion and while it may not be as important to the book as the Storyguide chapter, it's easily the most interesting and most rewarding reason to purchase. Rating: 5 out of 5 (All the most fun parts of the book can be found here.)

Appendix: For the most part, Titanomachy is written as a Storyguide resource. Titans, how to run them, a whole array of antagonists from them, it's clear that this mainly exists for the sake of the Storyguide. Until you get to the Appendix. Here's where the crunchy bits for the players can be found. New optional rules on Collateral damage, plus an assortment of Titan-themed Birthrights which can be used for Titan Scions or even your normal child of a god. Finally, it closes out with the Knacks that go along with those new Titanic Callings and... oh boy these Knacks all sound very fun to employ for characters who don't mind taking a villainous angle. Rating: 4 out of 5 (While the book could do without it, I love the fact that this is all here to use and enjoy)

Final Thoughts: This book isn't without its warts. But that's not a bad thing either. If you approach this book out of context and expect it to read like every other Scion book, you're going to be disappointed and have a bad time. But when taken into context and approached from the angle presented in the Introduction, this book is a welcome addition to the overall Scion game line. And even if you don't like the presentation of the Titans, the wealth of information to be found in the chapters on Storyguidng and Antagonists are well worth the cost and definiely have a place in your games of Scion.



Rating:
[5 of 5 Stars!]
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Titanomachy (A Collection of Threats for Scion Second Edition)
Publisher: Onyx Path Publishing
by Florian W. [Verified Purchaser]
Date Added: 09/06/2020 04:13:45

Awesome art and very solid mechanics, but with few exceptions (the Orisha chapter is a delight), the attitude of the product towards real-world religions is troubling. Continuing a trend from Companion, certain faiths are apparently deemed less worthy of respect than others and are subject to much stronger fabrication. Wicca and Neo-Paganism come off as empty, meaningless faux-religions here and Latin American (specifically Mexican) deities are once more called out as incompetent and lazy. There's a lot contradiction here with earlier books and with the promises and advertisements given when the project of a new edition of Scion was first introduced. Hopefully, this book remains the exception rather than the new rule for how Scion is done.



Rating:
[2 of 5 Stars!]
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